Home
Runyon's 1st Affirmative Andrews' 1st Negative Runyon's 2nd Affirmative Andrews' 2nd Negative Runyon's 3rd Affirmative Andrews' 3rd Negative Runyon's 4th Affirmative Andrews' 4th Negative
Andrews' 1st Affirmative Runyon's 1st Negative Andrews' 2nd Affirmative Runyon's 2nd Negative Andrews' 3rd Affirmative Runyon's 3rd Negative Andrews' 4th Affirmative Runyon's 4th Negative Andrews' 5th Affirmative Runyon's 5th Negative
MY SUMMATION
CONTACT PAGE

ANDREWS' FIRST AFFIRMATIVE

For the next four rounds I am going to be in the affirmative and my worthy opponent will be negating my affirmations. My proposition is as follows:

“THE SCRIPTURES TEACH THAT THE SECOND COMING OF THE LORD WILL BE A LITERAL, PHYSICAL AND VISIBLE COMING THAT IS STILL IN OUR FUTURE”.

By scriptures, I mean the 66 books of the Old and New Testament. II Timothy 3:16-17

By Teach, I mean that by studying the scriptures we are able to learn the truth. The scriptures are alive and powerful and through them we learn and are guided by the Holy Spirit. Knowledge is imparted when we study with an honest heart. (Acts 17:10-11; Hebrews 4:12; II Thessalonians 2:9-14)

By The Second Coming, I mean the second and final coming of the Lord when He comes in the clouds on that last day. I Thessalonians 4:13-18

By Literal, I mean this coming in the clouds is not a figurative coming; it will not be symbolic of anything. It will literally happen. The clouds will be literal, the Lord will be literal, and every literal eye will witness this. II Thessalonians 1:7-9

By Physical, I mean that He who is coming in the clouds is actually Jesus, albeit, in His Glorified Body. The same Jesus that ascended into heaven will come back from heaven in the same manner in which He left. Acts 1:9-11; I John 3:2

By Visible, I mean that it’s not going to be a secret or an invisible coming. It’s going to be witnessed by every person who has ever lived on earth, even those who drove the nails through His hands and feet. Revelation 1:7

By Still in our future, I mean it ain’t happened yet.

In any communication, whether it is vocal or written, there are certain rules we have to follow in order to understand the full meaning of what is being revealed to us. There are rules such as consistency, context and literal and/or figurative language that must be applied to get the full meaning. There are others, but these three are enough to get us through this study.

It doesn’t matter what you are studying, the same rules apply in this regard. YOU HAVE TO TAKE WHATEVER YOU SEE OR HEAR AS LITERAL UNLESS THE CONTEXT FORBIDS IT. You can argue against that if you want to, but I would rather you go to Puerto Rico and take it up with a coconut. You have to begin any topic with facts that are not in doubt and compare them to those that are symbolic or figurative. PLEASE REMEMBER YOU CANNOT ALLOW A FIGURATIVE PASSAGE TO OVERRIDE A LITERAL PASSAGE. The literal passages are trump. Having said this; I begin. All emphases are mine.

I. THE SECOND COMING OF THE LORD WILL BE LITERAL.

Below is my affirmation that the Lord’s second coming will be LITERAL:

II Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Each person is going to have to decide for themselves whether or not this passage is literal or if it is symbolic of something else. If it is figurative or symbolic, there has to be some indication that it is. You can read the entire chapter and you will not find any word, phrase or sentence that demands that you take this passage figuratively. My worthy opponent will appeal to figurative passages in the Old Testament and attempt to disprove the literal nature of this passage. He desperately wants it to be symbolic, but he cannot prove it. He will assert it; he will claim that these verses really don’t mean what they say and he will appeal to symbolic Old Testament passages in his attempt. Wait and see.

II. THE SECOND COMING OF THE LORD WILL BE PHYSICAL.

In other words, the very same Jesus that ascended to the Father will be the very same Jesus that will return on that last day, albeit, in his glorified body.

I John 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. (Emphasis Mine)

I Corinthians 15:35 ¶ But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?

36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:

38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

I Corinthians 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

I don’t have to understand it to believe it. Something is coming out of your grave on that last day. This is what the above verses are talking about. This is another one of those things that you don’t have to believe and yet it is still going to happen. In fact, you can rip I Corinthians 15 out of your Bible and it’s still going to happen.

Some folks want to poke fun at what these verses and this chapter are teaching. I’ve heard Preterist say in derision to these verses, “Jesus didn’t come to save our skin; He came to save us from our sin.” That’s catchy isn’t it? Now what they mean by this little snippet is, “Your physical body is going to rot and it’s never going to leave its rotting spot”, I just made that one up. I think mine is catchier than theirs.

I Corinthians 15 is teaching this, (in snippet form): “The plot you’re in when you decompose will be empty a second after you’ve arose”. How did you like that one? What about this one? “The clothes that you got buried in, will never have to be wore again”. One more for all the children, “I was missing a leg, when they covered me up, but I’m not going to need it when I am told to come up”.

Acts 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.

10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;

11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? THIS SAME JESUS, which is taken up from you into heaven, SHALL SO COME IN LIKE MANNER AS YE HAVE SEEN HIM GO. (Emphases Mine)

Did Jesus literally ascend into Heaven? Will He literally return the same way? Does, “This same Jesus” mean, “This same Jesus?”

III. THE SECOND COMING OF THE LORD WILL BE VISIBLE.

Look at the underlined and italicized words in the passage directly above; the apostles beheld Him, they looked steadfastly up toward Him, they gazed up at Him until He was taken from their sight.

Dear reader, Was this a historical event? Did the apostles see Christ literally ascend with their literal eyes? Were they literally looking up toward heaven? Did a literal cloud receive Him out of their sight? You draw your own conclusions, but I believe what the men (angels) told the apostles. It will be a literal and visible coming. If it isn’t please show me what makes this passage symbolic of something else. Please, don’t go to the Old Testament and appeal to some figuratively passage and attempt to trump these literal passages above. You can do it if you want to, but it only proves your desperation to hang on to your false doctrine.

If Jesus returned in 70AD, in the same manner in which He left, and every eye saw Him, how come you and I missed it?

Revelation 1:7 Behold, He cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see Him, and they also which pierced Him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of Him. Even so, Amen.

You do not have to have a code ring from a box of Lucky Charms to be able to understand the Bible. You don’t have to have someone tell you what to believe, not even me. You don’t have to have a certificate saying that you have graduated from the Preteristic College of Hermeneutical Exegesis. If you have common sense and an honest heart you can understand God’s Word.

Will the Apostles, along with every eye, from every person who has ever lived witness his return, based on the verses above? Is there something in these passages that forces us to make them symbolic of something else? Or do they teach what they are teaching?

IV. THE SECOND COMING OF THE LORD IS STILL IN OUR FUTURE:

The Lord hasn’t yet, but He will return again LITERALLY, PHYSICALLY AND VISIBLY for the second time. No man or angel knows when that moment will occur. (Matthew 24:36) There can be only one “Second Coming” that is described in Acts 1:9-11 and the other passages I have already mentioned. . I will readily admit that there were numerous FIGURATIVE “comings of the Lord’ in judgment on particular nations. For instance, Isaiah 13 records a coming destruction on Babylon that happened around 500 B.C. There are others, but the Second Coming of Christ is Literal and it’s greater in scope.

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him SHALL HE APPEAR THE SECOND TIME without sin unto salvation. (Caps and Emphasis are mine)

V. THINGS THAT WILL OCCUR AT THE LAST TRUMP.

I Corinthians 15:51 ¶ Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, AT THE LAST TRUMP: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. (Emphases Mine)

Now, are these three verses literal, or do you have to take a trip to the Old Testament and find some figurative verse to shove in here in an attempt to make them mean what they don’t mean?

I Thessalonians 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (Emphases Mine)

Now, are these three verses literal, or do you have to take a trip to the Old Testament and find some figurative verse to shove in here in an attempt to make them mean what they don’t mean?

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,

29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. (Emphases Mine)

Now, are these two verses literal, or do you have to take a trip back to the Old Testament and find some figurative verse to shove in here in an attempt to make them mean what they don’t mean? Also, since Jesus said these words Himself, do we have to find a prophecy in the Old Testament to validate Jesus’ Word?

II Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Now, are these three verses literal, or do you have to take a trip to the Old Testament and find some figurative verse to shove in here in an attempt to make them mean what they don’t mean?

II Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 ¶ Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

Now, are these three verses literal, or do you have to take a trip to the Old Testament and find some figurative verse to shove in here in an attempt to make them mean what they don’t mean?

Dear reader, I’m not psychic, but I imagine my worthy opponent is going to go back to the Old Testament and find some passages that contain symbolic language that relates to some other event and he is going to drag them over into the New Testament and using crowbars and sledgehammers he is going to ATTEMPT to make all of these literal passages mean just the opposite of what they mean.

In II Peter 3:8-10, I wouldn’t be surprised if he turned the heavens and earth and all the elements melting with fervent heat to mean something like the Law of Moses. Surely; he won’t say that it’s the Law of Moses, but we’ll see.

I agree that there are passages in the Old Testament that are types or shadows of things that would come. For instance, the Passover lamb in Exodus 12 was the type to Christ’s anti-type as a lamb being led to the slaughter Isaiah 53:7; Matthew 26:63; 27:12,14; Acts 8:32; I Peter 2:23.

There are Old Testament passages that shed light on New Testament passages, helping us to understand them better. There are things that happened in the Old Testament that POINTS to something in the New Testament. The Old Testament is useful and vital, but we are not to be guided by it, instead of the Law of Christ.

Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.

I Corinthians 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

When Israel took Jericho, they blew with the trumpets and shouted and the walls fell down flat. By faith and obedience they fell Hebrews 11:30 (They didn’t come tumbling down, they fell flat!) Joshua 6:5

When Gideon defeated the Midianites with only three hundred men, they used trumpets, torches and great shouts. Judges 7:16-22

There is nothing wrong with appealing to the Old Testament for further knowledge, but when you start dragging Old Testament examples and symbolism and forcing them into a faulty paradigm that contradicts scriptures that are easily understood to be literal, you have crossed over the line.

My worthy opponent is guilty of this. He holds up the Old Testament over the New Testament. He places preference on symbolic passages from the Old Testament that contradicts literal passages in the new.